Video: Why and how researchers should collaborate with policymakers: Interview with Marta Pulido (Part 1)

Researchers worldwide are often required to communicate the relevance of their work to policymakers. While this area of work has much in common with communicating science to the general population, there are important differences. Policy-related communication involves collaborating with policymakers and not just talking at them: it is a two-way interaction with shared goals, a common language, and shorter timelines than researchers are typically used to.

If you are a researcher whose work can directly inform policies, collaboration with policymakers need not be necessity-driven and something you do only when asked to. You can actively seek out opportunities to do so. In this 3-part interview series, Marta Pulido, Communications Officer at Institut d'Investigacions Biomèdiques August Pi i Sunyer (IDIBAPS) talks about how engaging in policy-related initiatives can benefit you as a researcher as well as the wider society, which skills you need, and how best to prepare yourself.

In this first segment, Marta discusses her background, her work collaborating with policymakers, the skills needed to communicate effectively with policymakers, and some common perceptions that scientists and policymakers may have about each other.

[VIDEO TRANSCRIPT]

Mriganka: Hello, everyone. I'm Mriganka Awati, Senior Writer at Editage Insights. At Insights, we're always working to bring you—researchers—knowledge and perspectives that will help expand your skills and identify ways to advance your careers.

And in this video, we are focusing on science communication for policymaking and why you should welcome opportunities to work on policy related initiatives because evidence informed policies are the need of the hour.

So, today I'm talking with Marta Pulido, Communications Officer at IDIBAPS. Welcome, Marta, and I'm really glad to have you here.

Marta: Thank you for the invitation, and it will be a pleasure to give any insight or advice to any researcher that is interested to pursue a career in policy and science communication.

Mriganka: Thank you. So, could you tell us a little bit about yourself and the work that you've done on science communication and especially policymaking?

Marta: Sure. Well, I'm a Ph.D. by training. Well, first of all, I got a degree in chemistry. Then, I got the Master's degree and Ph.D. in biomedicine specializing in neurodegenerative diseases. After all, I get a Master's degree in science communication. So, I spend my postdoc time doing half-time research and half-time science communication. But just before the pandemic, I moved full time to science communication, first in Investigacion y Ciencia, that is the Spanish edition of Scientific American, and after almost two years there, I moved to the research center where I post I did my postdoc, well, one of my postdocs, that is, in IDIBAPS, to be a science communicator at the Communications Office at IDIBAPS.

So, regarding the work with policy. I started back in 2018. I get involved in a project of science communication, oh sorry, of science diplomacy for Barcelona city. And after all, I get a training, a European training. It was the S44C program. It was a very interesting project, aimed to bring scientists like me, with interest in science communication and policy and diplomacy, some tools to get engaged with policymakers and diplomats, to move forward, put science on the focus of policy.

And so, resulting from all these projects, I got involved, in 2020, in a project in Latin America, that resulted in a paper that was “Bringing policymakers and scientists together through communication.” It was a very interesting project. And I think that we are just going to discuss it right now.

Mriganka: Sure. Can you share some learnings that you've had, major learnings you've had from the work that you've done in science diplomacy and policy-related initiatives?

Marta: Sure. Well, the first learning was that it's necessary for scientists to move out of the bench and go to the policy arena. I know it's very difficult because sometimes, scientists are not used to going outside the lab and engage with other public, that is not, you know, a technical or scientific one. But it's very necessary because although there's this thinking that the policymakers and diplomats are not interested in science, I must say that not all of them think like that.

I mean, of course, there are some policymakers and diplomats interested in science. The thing is that it's very difficult to find language, a common language, for all the parts involved. But I must say that nowadays, there's very interesting trainings. They are from European or American projects that they are found. Usually, you don't have to pay to get trained. So, it's a very positive thing.

And it's a very good opportunity to get the tools to get in contact with the other parts, you know, the side of policy and diplomacy. And my advice will be just to look for these programs on the internet and get involved, don't be shy. You know, in at first, you can be like, it's not my path, I’m not comfortable. Just try it. Just try to be involved with the correct people and expand your network.

And I think it's very interesting for researchers to get these skills, not only for the benefit of bringing science into policy. That, of course, it's a benefit for all society, and all around the world. But also, for your personal and own objectives because, for me, it was a very rewarding experience. I grew a lot of skills like, personal. I get more, you know, for me, it was easy to communicate. I learned the skills to adapt my language to engage, to network, because, as scientists we are used to networking in big meetings but it's among science. And, you know, we have the common goals of doing fun stuff and fun science and state-of-the-art techniques, but it's very important to go out.

Mriganka: So, what are some of the key skills that scientists need to develop that they may not naturally have, many of them may not naturally have, but they need to specifically build, if they are interested in doing work related to policies?

Marta: Okay, I will say maybe, because I'm biased, but I think that communication is key. And, of course, we know how to communicate, but with other scientists, not with people that are not in the science arena. So, it's very important to train yourself in explaining science in a plain way, I mean, without this technical language that it's very difficult to connect not only with policymakers and diplomats, but also with society.

For instance, I try to explain my research to my family that, well, there's no scientist in my family. I'm the first one. And, the first time was like, what? What is DNA transcription factor? A neuron? So, you know, I will recommend to train in science communication.

But I think that you also need the skills like, well, maybe it's not a skill, per se, but you will have to learn to listen. In a dialogue, it's very important to talk, of course. But it's also very important, if you want to connect with other people, to learn how to listen, to learn how to identify the needs of the other people.

It's also very important to do the networking, as I said before, you need these skills of networking, of collaboration, if you want to build bridges between science, policy, and diplomacy. You have to be this proactive person, just to have this attitude to go outside your, how to say, your comfort zone. I know it's a topic, but it is. And so, you need to be very empathic.

And also, I will say, be open-minded. I mean, in science, we are multicultural, we are used to be in a multicultural environment. But in policy and diplomacy, it's also very important to be open minded and be open to engage with other cultures, other languages, other people from around the world. And, as such bearing in mind these communication skills that it's not the same to engage with a scientist in China, than with a policymaker in China. They speak very different languages. They share the Chinese language, but they are not using the same words.

So, it's very important also, this. And, I think that's the main skills that you need. They are very, it's not something that you can learn like, well, for science communication, you can use some training, but are skills that I have learned by practicing. As I said before, this training in science diplomacy that I got, was very very useful at that point, because you learn by doing, you learn by going to meetings with policymakers and diplomats, listening how they talk, how they express themselves, what they need, then engage with them in coffee breaks. So, it's something that you learn by doing, as I said.

But, well, just don't be afraid. You need this kind of interpersonal skills, something that, at the end, you have to be human. In this these stereotypes of scientists being in our ivory tower, very cold, inaccessible, and so on. So, no. You have to connect. You have to be kind, you have to be very empathic. So, that's my advice.

Mriganka: I think those were some great points, because what I actually wanted to also start with before we moved on to the discussion on skills is, if you're aware of any common misconceptions and myths about, you know, work related to policymaking, or about policymakers that researchers may harbor,

possibly because they have not had the opportunities to interact directly with the stakeholders. So, what are, as you said, it's really important to listen to people, to be empathic, and to understand how to communicate effectively with them. So to get started, what would you say are some common misconceptions and myths that you would want to highlight, so that scientists know that that's the point where they can start working on?

Marta: Well, first of all, I don't know if it's a misconception, but it's something that is true. I will say that the main difficulty when engaging with policymakers and diplomats are the agenda. I mean that they have very busy timetables. And so, something that also happens besides this is that we are used to explaining some things, you know, in a very comprehensive way. We start with background, then with methods, then with results, then with discussion. And so, this takes long, lots of time. It's a very long time. So the thing is that when you engage with this kind of public, the policymakers and diplomats, because they have short time to give you attention, you need to go to straight to the point. I mean, it's very important to start, as we say, in the journal is, you know, not by background, but by conclusions. So, just flip your story.

And try to do an elevator pitch, like, if you have 30 seconds or one minute, try to explain your goal in this short time, just to get the attention of these people. Because sometimes, when I interview scientists that try to engage with policymakers and diplomats, they have this kind of “no, because they are not interested, they don't have time, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, they don't understand it.” But then I interview the other part, policymakers and diplomats, and they explain me like “yeah, you know, I go to the meeting, and then I have like, 60 minutes, like one hour, just the scientist speaking with a very, you know, very complex language, with a structure of long background, it was like, I don't..” It's maybe that they have the interest, but they don't have the capacity to really understand everything. So, they need to, you know, go to the point in a short time.

And then, so I think that this misconception between both parts it’s that they are interested in each other, but they don't have this, this piece of really being together to find the right time, the right language, the arena. I mean, there's few spaces for them to interact. So, this is another point. And altogether, we have this thinking that there's no interest, that science doesn't have an interest in policy and that policy doesn't have an interest in science. So, this is, for me, the main misconception that interest, there's interest. But we have to adapt both parts to get the right connection.

So, for me, it's that point. So, of course, you have scientists that don't want to know anything about policy and policymakers that have no interest in science. Of course. You know, this is a big world. We are so many people. But I have found very interesting that young generations, young scientists, and young policymakers are very active and very proactive and very willing to meet. So, this is another misconception.

In the second part of the interview, Marta discusses her observations of how collaborations between scientists and policymakers can differ across regions depending on the socio-political and cultural contexts. In the third and final part, she talks about how you can prepare yourself for collaborations with policymakers and discusses examples of successful collaborations between scientists and policymakers.